Glossary entry (derived from question below)
Spanish term or phrase:
Dominio perfecto
English translation:
Perfect command
Spanish term
Spain
Fast, accurate business & law specialist
Native in: English 
Works in: Spanish to English
Dominio perfecto
"Dominio perfecto del inglés y francés"
My question here is inevitably shaped by being a linquist - I know what the client wants to say but...
Aside from the fact that arguably "Dominio perfecto" can never exist, even in terms of one's mother tongue, there is the question of "bi/trilingualism", which goes far beyond simply being very good at so and so language.
What all my linguistic and teaching training tells me to put is "Advanced English and French" but this is clearly an under-translation
Would "near-native..." be acceptable? Any oither ideas?
Aug 3, 2009 15:08: Melissa Mann Created KOG entry
Non-PRO (1): Jim Tucker (X)
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A pro question is anything else... in other words, any question that requires knowledge or skills that are specialized (even slightly).
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Proposed translations
Brazil
*elegant spoken & written communication*
Native in: English
Works in: Portuguese to English, Spanish to English, English to Portuguese, and 1 more.
Perfect command of English and French
United States
A lifetime of translation
Native in: Spanish 
Works in: English to Spanish, Spanish to English
perfectly fluent in...
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Jenni Lukac (X)
: I would drop the "perfectly" but to be fluent in a language is correct.
3 mins
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Thanks Jenni, I agree with you
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Silvia Killian Özler
: dominio=fluency, to fit with the context
1 hr
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Thank you, Silvia
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Marjory Hord
: se me hace el más usado y correcto
1 hr
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Gracias, Marjory
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Rosa Paredes
: Fluency is just one aspect.
1 day 14 hrs
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United Kingdom
RELIABLE AND EFFICIENT, NATIVE EN-GB.
Native in: English (Variant: British)
Works in: Spanish to English
A good command of French and English (both written and spoken).
http://jobs.trovit.de/jobs/english-good-command-written-and-...
"Accounting degree or equivalent Profound knowledge of German real estate structures An extended knowledge of German GAAP (HGB) and Lux GAAP. A good command of German and English (both written and spoken)..."
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Melissa Mann
3 mins
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Thanks Melissa :-)
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Rosa Paredes
: This is what government offices in Canada use when recruiting staff
1 day 14 hrs
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Many thanks Rosa, have a nice weekend ;-)
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Spain
The translator people turn to
Native in: English (Variant: UK)
Works in: Spanish to English, French to Spanish, English, and 1 more.
complete mastery
Fluency I have my doubts over - I examine for very high level oral exams, and we calibrate fluency as one of the points - but it doesn't mean to say that there are not gaps in the candidates' knowledge of the language.
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JaneTranslates
: I've never cared for "fluent"--it's too often used imprecisely. Thanks for noticing my absence! Life sometimes intrudes on work and pleasure.
12 mins
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Thanks Jane - long time no see.
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Michele Fauble
4 hrs
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Thanks Michele
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Muriel Vasconcellos
: I prefer this to 'command', though it's not wrong. I also like 'complete' better than 'perfect', as no one is ever perfect in any language.
5 hrs
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Quite! Thanks Muriel.
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argosys
21 hrs
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Thank you.
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Spain
Sworn & legal. Contracts & CVs. PhD
Native in: Spanish (Variant: Standard-Spain)
Works in: English to Spanish, Spanish to English, French to Spanish
Native-like fluency in / command of
Suerte
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Note added at 3 hrs (2009-07-30 17:52:19 GMT)
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Una de las ofertas de traducciones que acaban de publicarse en Proz.com (http://www.proz.com/translation-jobs/344624) usa la frase "mother-tongue-level English</b >". Otra solución si no quieres usar "perfect".
Saludos.
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Sp-EnTranslator
: I'd go for native-like proficiency rather than fluency. This link might be useful http://74.125.95.132/search?q=cache:RjwLkw2pczMJ:www.lindhol...
1 hr
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Thank you, Claudia.
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Michael Powers (PhD)
10 hrs
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Muchas gracias, Mike. Saludos cordiales.
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United Kingdom
Linguistic flair and an eye for detail
Native in: English
Works in: Spanish to English, English
Native-speaker competence
Advanced language-learners aim for native-speaker competence. It is a chimera, of course, but I feel confident the term is good for your purposes here.
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Note added at 1 day15 hrs (2009-08-01 05:51:58 GMT)
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In answer to Rosa Paredes' comment:
"There have been several attempts over the years to define multilingualism without agreement. These definitions can be situated at the extremes of a definitional continuum from the minimalist, that is, the capacity to speak and/or understand an additional language to whatever degree of competence, to the maximalist, that is, native speaker competence in all four language skills (speaking, listening, reading, writing)."
http://au.encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_1481590907/multilingu...
Most translation agencies stipulate native speaker competence as a TL requirement of their translators - see e.g.
"Translators with native speaker competence have an extensive vocabulary at their disposal, are capable of expressing themselves in many different ways, can call on many different word combinations, turns of phrase, and sayings, and have the feel for the language that is necessary in order to use all these elements correctly. In addition, they are familiar with the cultural situation in their country and can adapt their translations to conform to it where necessary. With very few exceptions, it is only native speakers who can guarantee in their translation not just a correct rendering of the meaning of the original but also a perfect and varied presentation in the target language."
http://www.e-maze.cz/main.html
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Rosa Paredes
: Native speaker does not mean mastery of a language
1 day 11 hrs
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Having taught advanced English for many years and also studied Applied Linguistics at postgraduate level, I know that "native speaker competence" is the maximalist goal of advanced language learning. See added refs.
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Reference comments
United States
US Court Cert. 1980 Ph.D. 1981
Native in: English
Works in: Spanish to English, Portuguese to English, English to Spanish, and 2 more.
Measurements of fluency and proficiency
I believe the four subcomponents for the State Department language test are fluency, pronunciation, grammar and lexicon. Rarely, only 1 time out of 2000, can a non-native speaker that started a second langauge after puberty replicate native pronunciation. On the other hand, through extensive reading, etc., he can be better than most native speakers in vocabulary and with practice just as fluent. Likewise, grammar can be mastered.
Although too long, "native-like fluency/proficiency" or "near-native fluency/proficiency" would probably be better stated (although it is not) as "native-like proficiency / fluency" of educated native speakers"
My two cents
Of course, linguistically no one has perfect command or fluency, etc., of any langauge at all.
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