| Pages in topic: < [1 2] | Why would an agency requesting English into Spanish want native English speakers to quote? Thread poster: liz askew
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| Is it ALWAYS wrong to translate out of your mother tongue? | May 29, 2009 |
Could be an error but we don't know.
There can be situations where a native speaker of the source language can provide a better translation than a native speaker of the target language.
Couldn't it be that they are dealing with particularly complex texts? It could be that they have to translate recordings, which would be more easily understand by a native speaker...
Perhaps they are going... See more Could be an error but we don't know.
There can be situations where a native speaker of the source language can provide a better translation than a native speaker of the target language.
Couldn't it be that they are dealing with particularly complex texts? It could be that they have to translate recordings, which would be more easily understand by a native speaker...
Perhaps they are going to have native Spanish speakers to edit the translations afterwards.
Daniel ▲ Collapse
| | | | | What is the point? | May 30, 2009 |
Samuel Murray wrote: liz askew wrote:
Why would an agency who is requesting translators from English into Spanish want native English speakers (American or British) to quote?? What was their answer when you asked them about it?
Samuel is right.
What is the point of discussing issues without knowing the actual facts?
Has anybody bothered asking the actual job poster about the reason?
I would, but since I do not work in that pair, I normally don't even have access to those job postings.
It may be more entertaining playing with thoughts based on assumptions, but I really don't see the point when this particular topic will inevitably end up in the endless native vs. non-native, special fields and not and what is a mortal sin vs. a necessity, etc. etc debate.
We have had enough of that, don't we?
Katalin
| | | | | The client is always right! | May 30, 2009 |
... so say all customer service training programs.
Anyone who doesn't know already the Perché mi piace! joke may read it at http://www.proz.com/post/1034236#1034236 .
If the client wants a blond, blue-eyed, physically endowed female translator to do their JP-CN translation and voiceover work on Perché mi piace! grounds, it's their game! They will be the o... See more ... so say all customer service training programs.
Anyone who doesn't know already the Perché mi piace! joke may read it at http://www.proz.com/post/1034236#1034236 .
If the client wants a blond, blue-eyed, physically endowed female translator to do their JP-CN translation and voiceover work on Perché mi piace! grounds, it's their game! They will be the ones bearing the consequences and costs of little, inadequate, or no provider availability.
On the other hand, when I see a job that seems strikingly inadequate from sheer carelessness, I tend to warn either the poster or the job moderators. If the outsourcer really wants those features from their vendor, and doesn't care if that will leave them empty-handed, it's their right. ▲ Collapse
| | | | liz askew 
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:21
Member (2007)
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | What is the point? | May 30, 2009 |
How can I ask the agency when I am not entitled to quote for the job?
As for "what is the point?", if you don't feel there is a point, then what is the point of contributing to this discussion?. Negative comments don't help anybody.
Let us not start getting on our high horses.
Liz Askew
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liz askew
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:21
Member (2007)
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | The client is always right! | May 30, 2009 |
Yes,
Who am I to question anybody's reasons, motives or whatever?
I just won't get involved.
Yep, if the client wants a monkey, pink elephant, white elephant, or whatever to translate the document, then who am I to question it?
Cheers!
Liz
[Edited at 2009-05-30 15:04 GMT]
| | | | liz askew
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:21
Member (2007)
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Is it ALWAYS wrong to translate out of your mother tongue | May 30, 2009 |
Nobody even mentioned right or wrong in any case.
But, now you have asked the question, I can only answer this on a purely personal basis.
No, I would never translate out of my mother tongue. It would be very wrong of me, and only me, I am not talking about anybody else on the planet here, to translate into French or Spanish in my area of expertise (medical). Sure I can help colleagues on Proz, but on a professional basis, then no is my answer. Were I to translate ... See more Nobody even mentioned right or wrong in any case.
But, now you have asked the question, I can only answer this on a purely personal basis.
No, I would never translate out of my mother tongue. It would be very wrong of me, and only me, I am not talking about anybody else on the planet here, to translate into French or Spanish in my area of expertise (medical). Sure I can help colleagues on Proz, but on a professional basis, then no is my answer. Were I to translate medical stuff into Spanish or French in the medical field, then I would be entering into very dangerous territory indeed. Nay, it would be irresponsible.
There, you have my answer.
Have a good weekend!
Liz ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Exactly: what's "illogical" for our type of work might make sense .-/in other contexts | May 30, 2009 |
liz askew wrote:
Nobody even mentioned right or wrong in any case.
Well, you said: "I find this illogical". This and other comments seemed to me to point towards the idea of "wrong".
But, now you have asked the question, I can only answer this on a purely personal basis.
No, I would never translate out of my mother tongue. It would be very wrong of me, and only me, I am not talking about anybody else on the planet here, to translate into French or Spanish in my area of expertise (medical). Sure I can help colleagues on Proz, but on a professional basis, then no is my answer. Were I to translate medical stuff into Spanish or French in the medical field, then I would be entering into very dangerous territory indeed. Nay, it would be irresponsible.
Exactly, you would probably not do into French or Spanish the same type of translations that you do into English.
The thing is that we have not idea of what type of projects, this particular customer is doing.
In the world, people do many different types of translations and some times, a native speaker of the source language (with a good level in the target language) can do a better job than a native speaker of the target language.
Probably, these will be projects which have nothing to do with the types of projects that you or other posters are doing but keep in mind that our individual experience as translators is extremely small compared to the whole translation world.
Daniel
[Edited at 2009-05-30 18:08 GMT]
| | | | liz askew
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:21
Member (2007)
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | keep in mind that our individual experience as translators is extremely small compared to the whole | May 31, 2009 |
Hi Daniel
Yes, indeed, and the more I read on this forum the more it "educates" me about the rest of the world and the more I realise I am not here to defend what the rest of the world does, but to question it.
This is what makes life interesting. Were I to accept everything that everybody else does as "their business" and "their right" then I would be a pretty dull, unusual person indeed, and this is exactly what everybody the world over does, i.e. ask questions. Th... See more Hi Daniel
Yes, indeed, and the more I read on this forum the more it "educates" me about the rest of the world and the more I realise I am not here to defend what the rest of the world does, but to question it.
This is what makes life interesting. Were I to accept everything that everybody else does as "their business" and "their right" then I would be a pretty dull, unusual person indeed, and this is exactly what everybody the world over does, i.e. ask questions. This is a fundamental right too. What can actually happen is that if people like myself ask questions, some people automatically start getting on the defensive. Interesting, isn't it, human behaviour?
Cheers!
Liz ▲ Collapse
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liz askew
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:21
Member (2007)
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | "I find this illogical". This and other comments seemed to me to point towards the idea of "wrong" | May 31, 2009 |
Hello
There is no way that "illogical" ever means "wrong" in the moral sense, just look up any dictionary.
Sorry to be pedantic here, but do not misinterpret me or put a different slant onto my words. As an interpreter I am very conscious that I have to be as "honest" as possible in conveying exactly what people say [there is a huge responsibility placed on our shoulders] so I am very much aware of how misintepreting can lead to misunderstanding and irritation.
<... See more Hello
There is no way that "illogical" ever means "wrong" in the moral sense, just look up any dictionary.
Sorry to be pedantic here, but do not misinterpret me or put a different slant onto my words. As an interpreter I am very conscious that I have to be as "honest" as possible in conveying exactly what people say [there is a huge responsibility placed on our shoulders] so I am very much aware of how misintepreting can lead to misunderstanding and irritation.
Should I be misunderstood then this does not reflect well on me or my profession.
BTW the initial question was to receive thoughts and answers from other linguists and these are interesting.
Cheers!
Liz ▲ Collapse
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liz askew wrote:
Hello
There is no way that "illogical" ever means "wrong" in the moral sense, just look up any dictionary.
Sorry to be pedantic here, but do not misinterpret me or put a different slant onto my words. As an interpreter I am very conscious that I have to be as "honest" as possible in conveying exactly what people say [there is a huge responsibility placed on our shoulders] so I am very much aware of how misintepreting can lead to misunderstanding and irritation.
OK, I fully understand. Thanks a lot.
Daniel
| | | | liz askew
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:21
Member (2007)
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | OK, I fully understand. | May 31, 2009 |
Hello again Daniel
Many, many thanks for your understanding. I really do appreciate it:-)
[I have to bend 100% over backwards in my job as an interpreter, so it is very nice to have somebody understand me, for a change:-)]
Have a great Sunday!
Liz
| | | | liz askew
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:21
Member (2007)
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | No problem in wishing you luck! | Jun 1, 2009 |
Hello AWa
It was interesting to read your viewpoint and see the possible reasons for translating out of one's mother tongue. I do understand your points:-)
Liz
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| IMO the word 'illogical' implies 'mistaken, wrongheaded, irrational ...' (?) | Jun 2, 2009 |
liz askew wrote:
There is no way that "illogical" ever means "wrong" in the moral sense ...
Hello Liz. Sorry, I don't quite follow this point of yours, about 'morality' ... Whatever, the word 'illogical' surely would imply 'wrong/wrong-headed/irrational/mistaken in any society or community where rationality and commonsense are valued.
IMO replacing 'illogical' with 'not particularly logical' might soften/cool it a bit. [What do others think - is that putting too fine a point on it?] But as it stands, it could possibly seem to be a 'coloured' (subjective, pejorative, potentially inflammatory?) turn of phrase, so ... I'm not all that surprised that you got a reaction to it.
The distinction between 'pejorative', 'neutral' and 'praise' language is a feature of Chinese [I don't know about other languages] so I have become more aware of it ... nothing personal.
Lesley
[Edited at 2009-06-02 07:03 GMT]
| | | | liz askew
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:21
Member (2007)
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | IMO the word 'illogical' implies 'mistaken, wrongheaded, irrational ...' (? | Jun 2, 2009 |
Hello Lai
Well, "illogical" to me is pretty straightforward. As I said look up any dictionary. "Unreasonable" would be an equivalent. To me personally it has no moral slant on it whatsoever.
BTW, whatever we say nowadays we are held to account. Whatever others may think or feel I full intended to say "illogical".
Call me what you like, I can take it.
Sooner or later we have to be honest about what we mean and not couch our language in ambi... See more Hello Lai
Well, "illogical" to me is pretty straightforward. As I said look up any dictionary. "Unreasonable" would be an equivalent. To me personally it has no moral slant on it whatsoever.
BTW, whatever we say nowadays we are held to account. Whatever others may think or feel I full intended to say "illogical".
Call me what you like, I can take it.
Sooner or later we have to be honest about what we mean and not couch our language in ambiguous terminology.
Maybe I will get people's backs up by being frank, but that is part of my personality and if people don't like that/cannot accept that/accuse me of whatever, well I will just have to live with that.
Cheers!
Liz
[Edited at 2009-06-02 16:35 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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